Why bots can't use the Titan Options

[Dnamro]

Since this gets asked all the time, I am going to lay out the main problems with bots using the titan and make this a stiky.

- For bots to run around in the Titan, it would have to be navmeshed. To be able to navmesh it, the Titan can not be moved the entire game.

- Even with a stationary Titan that was navmeshed, because its up in the sky, the Titan navmesh won't be connected to the land navmesh, and bots won't be able to move between the land navmesh and the Titan navmesh (ignoring the fact that the AI does not like navmesh islands).

- Therefore, the titan would have to be grounded with ramps or stairways to get into it, so it could be properly navmeshed with the land navmesh so the bots could get into it. As a grounded titan, the bottom guns would need to be removed.

- Then there is the problem that there is no known method to let the bots know when the shield is down and they can go into the Titan. To get around that problem, the shield would have to be removed and the Titan health increased to make up for the missing shield.

- As far as bots using the drop pods, if the Titans have to be stationary and navmeshes have to be connected by the Titan being grounded or some sort of stairway, the bots will be able to use that to get into the Titan, so the drop pods are not necessary for the bots anyway.

- Even if the Titans are grounded and navmeshed so bot can go in and out, you still have the issue of getting the bots to attack the door shields and the objectives. In BF2 it is possible to get bots to attack destructable objects, but the inner shields and objectives are not seperate destruable objects. The shields and objectives on the titan would have to be removed or recoded as destructable objects.

As you can see, to get around the problems would require changing the Titan so much, that its not Titan Gameplay anymore. It might be fun, but it's a lot different from multiplayer Titan gameplay. Even with the editor, there are still many obstacles to playing in true Titan mode with bots.

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Alternatively, Just having the Titan's turrets autocontrolled would allow the titans to be used to attack and defend in coop, but bots would not be able to go into it. Autocontrolles will not fire until the shields are dropped. The shields can be removed. If the turrets could be made to be autocontrolled, it could make it very challenging trying to board the Titan. Once on board, the player would be have free reign inside the Titan.

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The Titan Lite coop mod will allow you and bots to capture the missle Silos in titan game mode, which will eventually result in the destruction of one of the team's Titans and the end of the game. The bots do not use the Titans in any way.

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Now it is possible to get bots to fly titans and fire the turrets and have a titan vs titan battle. The problem is that it would be best to be a space map, because the bots like to fly too close to the ground and crash very easily. There is no AI setting to tell the bot they are in a vehicle that is very large, so the bots fly them as if they were much smaller.

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What has been tried so far:

One of the regulars here created the AI mesh that would allow bots to run around on a docked titan. The problem is that the titans are vehicles and the bots want to interact with vehicles, and don't want to run around on them, so they are just confused.

Another regular here, tried to create a stationary titan and was able to get the bots to run around on it using the Wake Island map. But, the textures of the titan have a weird glow when it's converted to a stationary object that he could not figure out. He gave up and moved onto other easier projects.

Unfortunately there are just too many other easier AI projects to work on.

[Restnpit]

Ez managed to get a static titan setup and navmeshed using Satanav's mesh, but the static titan was too bright and he gave up on it.

Does the static titan look bright as the one on this video?

http://www.dailymotion.com/user/Restnpit/v...aron_videogames

[EzPiKnZ[ONT]]

Ez managed to get a static titan setup and navmeshed using Satanav's mesh, but the static titan was too bright and he gave up on it.

That almost makes it sound like I didn't fight it out (almost solely) for more than a couple weeks. I've tried everything I could think of to get something working, static and pco, and when I asked for a little help none was given.

Does the static titan look bright as the one on this video?

http://www.dailymotion.com/user/Restnpit/v...aron_videogames

More or less. Sticks out like a sore thumb, which is why it never released 'as is' despite the wanting for both Wake SP and a static Titan 'test' map.

See the rest of pics posted during the process here. I can't remember where all the posts are on these forums.

[Restnpit]

Here is the eu_titan_exterior_main_front .tweak I use to fix my own brigthness problem. With it, Titantank in Reddawn has a beautifull orangy hull.

But I have still problem, sometimes, titan parts disappeared a very short time and lod (i think it is) change brutally.

CODE

rem *** Generated with Bf2Editor.exe [created: 2006/6/21 5:15]
GeometryTemplate.setSubGeometryLodDistance 1 0 90
GeometryTemplate.setSubGeometryLodDistance 1 1 150
GeometryTemplate.setSubGeometryLodDistance 1 2 240
GeometryTemplate.setSubGeometryLodDistance 2 0 90
GeometryTemplate.setSubGeometryLodDistance 2 1 150
GeometryTemplate.setSubGeometryLodDistance 2 2 240

GeometryTemplate.compressVertexData 1
GeometryTemplate.maxTextureRepeat 16
ObjectTemplate.activeSafe SimpleObject eu_titan_exterior_main_front
ObjectTemplate.creator MBA-3:mba
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser "Rip"
ObjectTemplate.saveInSeparateFile 1
ObjectTemplate.geometry eu_titan_exterior_main_front


ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial 0 collision 0
ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 0
ObjectTemplate.hasCollisionPhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.physicsType Mesh

Here is the original one:

CODE

rem *** Generated with Bf2Editor.exe [created: 2006/6/21 5:15]
GeometryTemplate.isTitanExterior 1
GeometryTemplate.setSubGeometryLodDistance 0 0 75
GeometryTemplate.setSubGeometryLodDistance 0 1 150
GeometryTemplate.setSubGeometryLodDistance 0 2 400
GeometryTemplate.doNotGenerateLightmaps 0
GeometryTemplate.lightmapOverride 0
GeometryTemplate.compressVertexData 1
GeometryTemplate.maxTextureRepeat 16
ObjectTemplate.activeSafe SimpleObject eu_titan_exterior_main_front
ObjectTemplate.creator MBA-3:mba
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser "mba"
ObjectTemplate.saveInSeparateFile 1
ObjectTemplate.geometry eu_titan_exterior_main_front
ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 0

[Restnpit]

I tried to have some destructable shields, but the collisiongroup that allow friend to go through make them invulnerable. Without they can be detroyed but we can't go through.

Big problem

[Restnpit]

I was wrong.

The destructable shield is based on a "commander_orbital_strike", all my test were on coop map and shields were spawns instead of vehicles. He didn't work.

I tried to put them in the titan, I make them spawn with an objectspawner (the AT_spawner actually). I can go through them AND destroy them.

[Restnpit]

I tried to had moving titan on regular map. I had one in titanlite 2. I had the brigthness bug that has been fix by rename the titan as the original (as_titan ). I put an engine that make the titan boardable. Bots spawn directly in it.

By trying to make it moving, I had to remove the line "ObjectTemplate.addTemplate TitanControlObjectPAC". The consequence was that the titan interior wasn't "loaded" anymore. Then I tried to make the interior visible and here is the best I had:



Then, I tried a non moving titan (still with bots spawning in it, even the driver). Here, by going inside the titan, interior was correctly loaded:




In both case, the titan as the same properties as the original.
I'll although tried to have some sentry-gun spawn (Spawned with an objects spawner) in the titan to improve boarding difficulties and compensate the lack of bots. With well placed traps, it could fun for a human team.



Unfortunetly, as you can see, I have very poor graphism (actually, the worst bf2142 can do) and running the editor takes me ages and always crash so I can't load the titan to have proper coordinates to spawn turrets.


Anyway, is there a way to make bots spawn on the titan wherever it is on the map?
They don't even when you are a squad leader, I guess it is due to the titan's height?

Is it possible to have some help?


EDIT: I noticed that EU and AS titans are not exaclty made the same, does anyone know what does this difference do?

This post has been edited by Restnpit: Sep 6 2009, 05:55 AM

[Dnamro]

If you can send me your changes, I can play around with it and see what I can do.

[MasterChiefRulZ]

Great work Restnpit! Hopefully someday the community will see a "Destroy the Titan" sp and cooperative level.

[EzPiKnZ[ONT]]

Anyway, is there a way to make bots spawn on the titan wherever it is on the map?
They don't even when you are a squad leader, I guess it is due to the titan's height?

Is it possible to have some help?

The titan needs to be in a fixed poistion for bot play due to the way pathfinding works. If there is no aiMesh present under the spawnpoint and the bot spawns, it will soon suicide in hopes of a valid spawn next time. Also, they will only attempt to spawn on the squad leader if he/she/it is on valid aiMesh. I've had them spawning in Wake in my glow in the dark static Titan and out through to caro bay.

*edit* I've never seen a bot use a mobile spawn in bf2 and up, but haven't been all that focused on it. Not sure if they use the beacon in 2142 or are just spawning off me as I always play SL to call in my drops/uav.

This post has been edited by EzPiKnZ[ONT]: Sep 10 2009, 08:33 PM

[MasterChiefRulZ]

I've never seen a bot use a mobile spawn in bf2

AIX has had success with mobile spawns and bots, as far as spawning into a seat of a vehicle. Bots spawning into a wide open flying Battleship (onto their feet), that might be a wee bit different.

Still, they spawn next to squad leaders... but then, the ground normally isn't moving under a SL's feet either.


Best bet in ever having Titans in sp/coop, is to have them stationary.

[clivewil]

I've never seen a bot use a mobile spawn in bf2 and up, but haven't been all that focused on it.

i've had bots spawn into the back seat of my 2-seater a few times, but it is very rare unless i am a squad leader - then it becomes much more frequent. note that my backseater ai usually has a very high temperature to persuade the bots to fill both seats before takeoff, and that might be why i get some mobile-spawning where other do not

[Restnpit]

i've had bots spawn into the back seat of my 2-seater a few times, but it is very rare unless i am a squad leader - then it becomes much more frequent. note that my backseater ai usually has a very high temperature to persuade the bots to fill both seats before takeoff, and that might be why i get some mobile-spawning where other do not

Bots act exactly the same with the parasite in my zombiland. It has beacon propreties, as far as I'm a squad leader, they (sometimes) spawn on it.

For the moving Titan, the way I make bots stay in it was just "no exit anymore!" and all the spawnpoints of the main base with the same coordinates than the titan. So other bots will have to wait that the titan take a controlpoints.

For the non moving one. All spawnpoints are the same, but bots can exits from groundcannon through podlauncher (doesn't work verywell, I don't understand everything but I know it's my fault! )I thought that if they have an exit, they will use it as soon as they spawn but even in groundcannons they sometimes stay in it and that is nice from them.